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Thread: 4G units - not for now

  1. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by sparks View Post
    haha i like that dream....politics my dear friend is a hell of a thing. people fighting for lions market share and whoever can tout the most money to influence telecoms standard thats who's gonna win for next generation cellular technology. I've worked with some LTE equipment they have devices but they're not in a consumer ready form. Personally I think LTE is going to win in the US based on some arguments from major hardware n software providers but its still a long way off so anything can happen. Both these technologies are in infancy and the standards are not set in stone yet.

    We can only dream of those theoretical speeds that are spoken of. Only the engineers and researchers ever get to see them..in a lab with crazy oscilloscopes and spectrum analyzers etc...
    if lte goes to the us and wimax to europe my money will be on wimax.
    Nokia and samsung who together make 60% of all devices sold are from the east.

    Considering that the nokia-siemens telecom group has wimax tech in their infrastructure, we could really c where most devices are headin.

    This is if wimax goes to europe, if it does, it will be the mostly used standard.
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  2. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by kalel17 View Post
    if lte goes to the us and wimax to europe my money will be on wimax.
    Nokia and samsung who together make 60% of all devices sold are from the east.

    Considering that the nokia-siemens telecom group has wimax tech in their infrastructure, we could really c where most devices are headin.

    This is if wimax goes to europe, if it does, it will be the mostly used standard.
    Why do you think so? Nokia-Sieimens already stopped backing them since they lost the bid for spectrum allocation in the EU. Thats why we have seen no handsets from the these EU companies as yet. Remember Nokia had a WIMAX version of the N810 planned? That was canned after the licensing issue went down for WIMAX.

    LTE is whats getting the full backing nowadays esp since they are currently delivering faster average speed with HSPA+ than with WIMAX. Even without a 4G LTE Standard, the 3.5G LTE (HSPA+) is kicking WIMAX's arse.

    Notice also that the only 4G WIMAX handsets announced since are from North American companies like HTC who are the only ones to actually build a unit and release it so far and even though it was intended for Europe, it wasn't for the EU but for Russia.

    Technically most new 3G handsets are capable of speeds exceeding that of WIMAX's current average speeds. Even Nokia's new E72 is a HSDPA, 10.2 Mbps capable unit.

    Even though it was cheaper for Digicel, a 2G network to adopt WIMAX without implementing a 3G infrastructure first, it isn't as cost effective for Operators already committed to 3G to go that route esp when LTE/GSMA offers cheaper more compatible upgrades.

    I will reiterate that the reason for the widespread adoption of WIMAX in the US is mainly because its a predominantly American based standard. The one major player in the US who isn't US owned (T-Mobile) isn't backing WIMAX any at all, in fact they are planning HSPA+ deployments as we speak.

    I must admit that it would be nice to see them approve competing standards but I doubt that WIMAX will become the dominant standard adopted by Telecoms in the long run.
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  3. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by g2cris View Post
    Why do you think so? Nokia-Sieimens already stopped backing them since they lost the bid for spectrum allocation in the EU. Thats why we have seen no handsets from the these EU companies as yet. Remember Nokia had a WIMAX version of the N810 planned? That was canned after the licensing issue went down for WIMAX.

    LTE is whats getting the full backing nowadays esp since they are currently delivering faster average speed with HSPA+ than with WIMAX. Even without a 4G LTE Standard, the 3.5G LTE (HSPA+) is kicking WIMAX's arse.

    Notice also that the only 4G WIMAX handsets announced since are from North American companies like HTC who are the only ones to actually build a unit and release it so far and even though it was intended for Europe, it wasn't for the EU but for Russia.

    Technically most new 3G handsets are capable of speeds exceeding that of WIMAX's current average speeds. Even Nokia's new E72 is a HSDPA, 10.2 Mbps capable unit.

    Even though it was cheaper for Digicel, a 2G network to adopt WIMAX without implementing a 3G infrastructure first, it isn't as cost effective for Operators already committed to 3G to go that route esp when LTE/GSMA offers cheaper more compatible upgrades.

    I will reiterate that the reason for the widespread adoption of WIMAX in the US is mainly because its a predominantly American based standard. The one major player in the US who isn't US owned (T-Mobile) isn't backing WIMAX any at all, in fact they are planning HSPA+ deployments as we speak.

    I must admit that it would be nice to see them approve competing standards but I doubt that WIMAX will become the dominant standard adopted by Telecoms in the long run.
    yup but lipcences hav been granted in europe for the 3.5 ghz frequency with 5.3 ghz currently in the waitin for a liscence.

    Hspa 10.2 doesnt mean the network speed will reach anywhere near that. From the initiation of hsdpa most networks cap it at between 40-60% of its peak rate mostly for its stability.

    With hspda 3.6 networks offer 1.5-2 mbps and hspda 7.2 saw non reaching 4mbps. Its just the fact, hspda become very unstable and resource consuming when put too much near its peak. I dont believe hspda 10.2 will reach 6mbps, or even much beyond 5mbps.

    Wimax at 4mbps downloads faster than hspda at its 5-6mbps cap. Simply because it has less jitter and doesnt transfer in packets. With hspda 10.2 it may fluctuate from several hundred kbps to around 5mbps while wimax will stay within its border of 2-4mbps much more frequently and under much more load.

    Wimax 05 or 802.16e can reach 12mbps second at a constant download speed, if the network decide to. Next gen wimax, which will be around in lte era has max speeds in excess of 100mbps and constant speeds at around 20mbps.
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  5. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by kalel17 View Post
    yup but lipcences hav been granted in europe for the 3.5 ghz frequency with 5.3 ghz currently in the waitin for a liscence.
    Licensing on the lower frequencies does matter because those high frequencies are not gonna be the frequencies on which most handsets are based. Those radios will kill the poor batteries in your phone, if WIFI at 2.5 GHz murders battery life like that (I know 3G does too) then WIMAX will have to be an add on feature like WIFI, which isn't good if you are to be the 4G standard.
    They may as well just try and compete with WIFI then for space on the handset (which is what will eventually happen).

    What I would love to see though is WIMAX maturing to a point where its attractive to providers, not only for data but as a complete wireless platform for voice calls too, where handset makers can base complete lines off the technology and users can have a seamless experience like we now do with 2/3G

    Quote Originally Posted by kalel17 View Post
    Hspa 10.2 doesnt mean the network speed will reach anywhere near that. From the initiation of hsdpa most networks cap it at between 40-60% of its peak rate mostly for its stability.

    With hspda 3.6 networks offer 1.5-2 mbps and hspda 7.2 saw non reaching 4mbps. Its just the fact, hspda become very unstable and resource consuming when put too much near its peak. I dont believe hspda 10.2 will reach 6mbps, or even much beyond 5mbps.

    Wimax at 4mbps downloads faster than hspda at its 5-6mbps cap. Simply because it has less jitter and doesnt transfer in packets. With hspda 10.2 it may fluctuate from several hundred kbps to around 5mbps while wimax will stay within its border of 2-4mbps much more frequently and under much more load.

    Wimax 05 or 802.16e can reach 12mbps second at a constant download speed, if the network decide to. Next gen wimax, which will be around in lte era has max speeds in excess of 100mbps and constant speeds at around 20mbps.
    I know that you were gonna argue on the virtues of a both technologies (well one technology in your case), but since none of them are complete and I am beginning to see where they are on par in most ways at this point in time, I would rather not get into it.

    My point was that The backward compatibility will be much more of an issue than those points, and both points are left up to both set of engineers to iron out. I would rather take an objective look at how bright the future looks for each set of technologies and hope that either one of two things happen.

    i) they converge, given that they both have strengths that are definitely beneficial to each others platform and they also both have weaknesses that could possibly be dealt with by converging. Making for a stronger 4G platform than one that would otherwise be one sided or possibly segmented.

    ii) Both standards mature (soon) and become robust, backward compatible 4G standards with just a mater of choosing the more favored platform by telecoms providers.
    THANK GOD

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