Professors Slam Java As "Damaging" To Students

[zRo ToLeRaNcE]

"The resulting set of skills [from today's educational practices] is insufficient for today's software industry (in particular for safety and security purposes) and, unfortunately, matches well what the outsourcing industry can offer. We are training easily replaceable professionals... Java programming courses did not prepare our students for the first course in systems, much less for more advanced ones. Students found it hard to write programs that did not have a graphic interface, had no feeling for the relationship between the source program and what the hardware would actually do, and (most damaging) did not understand the semantics of pointers at all, which made the use of C in systems programming very challenging."

Slashdot Article

Original Professor Article - Computer Science Education: Where Are the Software Engineers of Tomorrow?

This article can be looked on in two (2) ways...one either these are just 2 old fuddy duddy professors that don't want to move with the times

or

2. They really do have a point.

I believe it's really the second point.
It seems that there exists some Universities that start programmers off on Java. Now, I'm not a programmer BUT to have started programming with Java would really limit my abilities to learn other things. Worse, it limits your ability to spread your wings.

At Utech - even before specialising, you learn pseudocode...the most important skill a programmer MUST have.
Then you learn a little assembly language, then C and C++, then that language that expert systems use (don't remember the name of it), then Java.

That progression to me has allowed me to be able to tackle programming tasks without being a programmer. My understanding of C and C++ has allowed other programming language to just be....easy

I'm on the side of the professors.

[norminator]

Slashdot Article

Original Professor Article - Computer Science Education: Where Are the Software Engineers of Tomorrow?

This article can be looked on in two (2) ways...one either these are just 2 old fuddy duddy professors that don't want to move with the times

or

2. They really do have a point.

I believe it's really the second point.
It seems that there exists some Universities that start programmers off on Java. Now, I'm not a programmer BUT to have started programming with Java would really limit my abilities to learn other things. Worse, it limits your ability to spread your wings.

At Utech - even before specialising, you learn pseudocode...the most important skill a programmer MUST have.
Then you learn a little assembly language, then C and C++, then that language that expert systems use (don't remember the name of it), then Java.

That progression to me has allowed me to be able to tackle programming tasks without being a programmer. My understanding of C and C++ has allowed other programming language to just be....easy

I'm on the side of the professors.

I'm also on the side of the professors, but you have to look on things from the 2 point of views.

1. I also went to utech, and went through the process of learning pseudocode, c, c++, assembly language, java ,clipse, prolog (expert systems languages), vb and it goes on.

But what I realise is that for some ppl they would have preferred if they had learnt java/vb first as it is easier, and they go on and say because C, C++ had already turned them off from programming. Well I never agree, C, C++ and the other so called difficult languages taught you the basics and gave you a better understanding about the field. And I think its the best way to root out the non programmers.

Now dont get me wrong I prefer using vb, java and all the other visual stuff now, but learning the C's and the assembly languages made it easier for me to understand programming overall.

Bwoy I remember the days of pointers lol

[CyberCat]

Students found it hard to write programs that did not have a graphic interface,

What the hell do they mean by that?

[norminator]

What the hell do they mean by that?

What I believe they meant is, anybody can correct me if I'm wrong, is what we call drag and drop, or easy to use editors like java net beans, microsoft visual studio, java eclipse. Maybe because people do and still write programs using notebook.

[psilos]

What I think he means by that is exactly what he said Graphical Interface Programs. In other words programs that require a mouse and windowing system. Many C programs are command line based and just run in the background if you know what I mean. Java apps can run that way as well but usually most programmers create them to function with a GUI.

[pogi_2nr]

Well I am with the profs.. this has long been my point of view.

long live c

[Electrotechnic]

LOL.....LOOL..... poor UWI graduate post the C++ era. Haskell really futt them up. Those who prospering now did A Level Comsci which had C. Why offer a course that requires background knowledge on a subject area which they are not prepared to teach or go over and not make that background knowledge a pre-requisite for the course. Like Mathematics ALONE can teach you programming.

[duster]

To me programming in C++ as a beginner is "baptism by fire". I remember all my days of programming i used to ask when are we going to do GUI. I believe to a begginer all that code without a GUI to look at get frustrating and boring. Growing up i always wanted to be a programmer but c++ really turned me off thats why i switch to networking. professors should teach java,vb first then go to C,C++. thats just my opinion.

[leoandru]

I disagree with the professor, not all programmers are "system programmer" as a matter of fact most are desktop application programmers and they master what they need for their professions. System programmers on the other hand need to master assembly, C, C++ etc..
Why try to spread yourself thin trying to master everything. Anyways My knowledge of C, C++ and assembly made me a much much better application programmer, especially when you truly understand how a system works you can program an application to take advantage of that knowledge.

[duster]

well to me programming is like learning to be a mechanic. If i was teaching someone to fix cars i would me sure they are drivers first. Let them enjoy the benefits of driving and complete functionality of vehicles then create curiousity of the inner workings. I would hate to fling him in the grease on the first day, repair a water pump the next,have him rebuild a transmission the third, then rewire the entire electrical system by the end of week. poor guy would probably never show up to work the next week.